Where does the team go from here?

[Don Giovanni]

I think it's a mistake to fire Anastasiadis. Unless the players lose faith in him or we start losing more games, he has to stay put. The alternative is not going to be Michel, it's going to be someone like Dellas and a crew of the retired Euro 2004 players, some of whom are already working side by side with Anastasiadis anways.

Tactically, our approach against Italy was correct. We pressed them high to prevent Veratti, Jorginho and Bonucci from playing their game and we tried to force turnovers and errors to help create chances for ourselves. We kept our line high in order to keep things compact and to force Italy into playing long balls, so that they couldn't easily play out of their defense. We had big men on the pitch to win aerial battles and held a height/physical advantage over Italy. That was our approach until we shipped in three goals, at which point it was about containing the damage. The problem is we were not accustomed to this setup. Players like Fortounis, Siovas and Zeca were played in roles they were not properly suited to play, but I can understand why Anastasiadis chose them in those roles. He's not a lunatic, but Anastasiadis is to blame for having handicapped himself by excluding Torosidis and Tachtsidis from the team. I think Lykogiannis should have been part of the squad too and that we lacked options at CB. This is was the first fatal mistake Anastasiadis made.

Samaris helms Benfica's midfield, no other Greek midfielder plays consistently for a club of that quality, and he does well there, but Benfica have other players in the middle who handle the bulk of the possession. I think he's very good in the half-back position, mopping up in front of the defense and plugging away at gaps. We need to play him in a manner that suits him and he's at his best as a third center/half-back. He's not a proper midfielder. He can't command possession well enough. But we need him to organize the team and keep things tight.

Greece did play a high line initially. Anastasiadis kept waving his players to push forward. If you look at our players before Italy scored, we were blitzing them. We put Italy under pressure deep in their half. Anastasiadis tried to keep Italy from playing their game, but Italy succeeded in bypassing our press and finding gaps on the right. They stretched us and we were bent out of shape on the first two goals. The third goal was a result of us holding our heads down and losing determination. Italy also played with a lot of quality and took full advantage of the chances presented to them.

As for Fortounis, Anastasiadis decided to play him in something of a free role. He is our best player, but for the match against Italy I think we may need to keep him in our holster and play him in the final stages, either to get a goal or to add a second. There was no easy solution for Greece up top against Italy; not with Donis and Mitroglou out injured; not with Mantalos and Mitroglou out of form; not with players like Pelkas, Kolovos, Masouras, and Durmishaj who are not experienced enough; and not with players like Koulouris and Bakasetas who are not capable of playing against the likes of Italy. Bakasetas needs to be cut from the team. Koulouris may have a use against Armenia. It will take time to find the right mix of players and to blend them.

[Reaper]

Reaper what are your honest views on Tachtsidis?

Don't rate him. Hugely disappointed in him having followed his career from the beginning. Was hoping that all those clubs in Italy - one after another - would make him at least robust, at least a bully, at least a presence on the field - at least something able to compensate his massive lack of pace - perhaps good technique, excellent passing, good reading of the game. I suspect Olympiacos hoped for the same when they signed him.

When he was at Olympiacos - he was poor. Slow, poor passer, poor positionally, average touch. The most negative thing about him however was comparing him to our other, mostly uninspiring CMs from the 2017-2018 season. Every single midfielder we had offered more than him, Gillet, Androutsos, Ofoe - even Romao who I also disliked. So many games Tachtsidis played he was invisible. No presence, no speed when he had the ball, just nothing. I also looked for those killer passes he is famed for - we saw 2 assists all season..and one goal in the cup.. There was also good emotion and support for him. Everyone knows Greece needs CMs. He was given every opportunity to do something - show something - but there was nothing there. When he left I was relieved.

[Dean97]

Do you think he would suit the 10 role like Don said, or no? It seems as though he has been playing better at Leece. I thought he had a bizarre season at Olympiakos. He wasn’t his usual self. Played like an out of form Tziolis at times. Misplaced passes, poor control, not much involvement, no presence etc. I see that aek66 and Don seem to be fans of him and see the positives in his game. I’m in the middle with him. I’m open to give him another chance but I believe he isn’t the whole answer.

[Reaper]

I

Tactically, our approach against Italy was correct. We pressed them high to prevent Veratti, Jorginho and Bonucci from playing their game and we tried to force turnovers and errors to help create chances for ourselves. We kept our line high in order to keep things compact and to force Italy into playing long balls, so that they couldn't easily play out of their defense.

Don, that is not what I saw. The Italians easily made it to our byline by playing the ball on the ground under little pressure from our team and put in countless crosses from near the corner flag into our box. It was incessant. The Italians did not have to resort to high balls over the top. They played through us and there was panic each time they did. The Italians were able to keep the ball on the ground and only started to encounter Greeks in any numbers half way through our own half. I can find the full game if you want to watch it. It was brutal. There was no high Greek line. We were sat deep in our own half every time they had possession.

Samaris helms Benfica's midfield, no other Greek midfielder plays consistently for a club of that quality, and he does well there, but Benfica have other players in the middle who handle the bulk of the possession. I think he's very good in the half-back position, mopping up in front of the defense and plugging away at gaps. We need to play him in a manner that suits him and he's at his best as a third center/half-back. He's not a proper midfielder. He can't command possession well enough. But we need him to organize the team and keep things tight.

Yes, he is consistent for Benfica and you describe his weaknesses well. I have watched about half a dozen Benfica games this season. What helps Samaris is the frenetic energy of the players around him at Benfica. Most the time there is a pass on, the players he passes to have one touch control and that suits him getting into the rhythm of the game. He has a normal coach - who plays players in normal positions. He is instructed what to do and in large part does it.

If you look at our players before Italy scored, we were blitzing them. We put Italy under pressure deep in their half.

There was no point we were blitzing them. The tactics our coach employed failed immediately - Italy did not score on their first full attack - they scored after many successful attacks down our right and they looked dangerous from the beginning in our half. There was plenty of room in our half when they had possession. The right hand side of our side of the pitch was empty. I did see Anastasiadis telling players to get forward as you said, but we held a deep line when Italy were in possession and boy they found it easy. If they hadn't taken their foot off the gas second half it could have been 5 - no problem.

As for your point about someone like Dellas replacing Anastasiadis, I think you may be right. However, when Skibbe was sacked it was obvious the EPO would replace him with another shit and cheap coach but I still wanted him gone anyway. Same with Anastasiadis. Just want him gone. If it takes another 3 shit coaches before we get a decent one, same procedure. As Tiger will have to learn, saving 500k by employing a cheaper coach does not work out cheaper in the long run when you have to sack them early and replace them. EPO has to learn that lesson. It didn't learn it before because the Greek media put no pressure on them over Skibbe. Anastasiadis has shown enough lack of knowledge to show he harms our NT. If we lost 4-0 vs Italy but I saw players knowing their roles, fight, spirit, players making chances - some decent passing - a present midfield - I would give him the benefit of the doubt. Alas - there was nothing and each game under him we go further backwards imo. He represents panic and chaos. We need a coach with a plan beyond 3 CBs, 3 DMs and a LB who can't defend for good measure.

[Reaper]

Do you think he would suit the 10 role like Don said, or no? It seems as though he has been playing better at Leece. I thought he had a bizarre season at Olympiakos. He wasn’t his usual self. Played like an out of form Tziolis at times. Misplaced passes, poor control, not much involvement, no presence etc. I see that aek66 and Don seem to be fans of him and see the positives in his game. I’m in the middle with him. I’m open to give him another chance but I believe he isn’t the whole answer.

I only saw him play as a clean CM for Olympiacos and he was terrible. As a 10 I suspect he could be better yes - but as good as a player like Fortounis in that position? I don't think so. Samaris also looks better to me the higher up he plays.

[Don Giovanni]

Look at where Samaris picks up his yellow, deep in Italy's half. We pressed very high and tried to play the ball around Italy's penalty area. Our press was poor which is why Italy bypassed it with ease. Kolovos, Fortounis, and Masouras were not daunting enough for the Italian back line. Zeca joined in and that's where Italy finally carved out enough space for themselves to score. Before then, we outnumbered in our defense to deal with their threat.

[Reaper]

Look at where Samaris picks up his yellow, deep in Italy's half. We pressed very high and tried to play the ball around Italy's penalty area. Our press was poor which is why Italy bypassed it with ease. Kolovos, Fortounis, and Masouras were not daunting enough for the Italian back line. Zeca joined in and that's where Italy finally carved out enough space for themselves to score. Before then, we outnumbered in our defense to deal with their threat.

When you press high, the idea is that the CBs are close behind the mids. There was a massive gap between the mids and defence which allowed Italy to run through the spaces behind the two banks. When Italy had the ball, our CBs were hovering around our box.. This is not pressing high. This is sitting deep. I did see Anastasiadis telling players to push up, but it did not see it happen. Even Barkas I think was telling them to push up and stop inviting pressure.

Samaris was all over the place during the game. CM, RB, DM - it was chaos. There was no plan. There was no system. Everyone was confused. Even Siopis his usually positions himself well was running all over the place. There was no system - no tactic. Forget us not practising free kick routines (unforgivable for a side such as ourselves) or knowing how to take a throw in - the players were spread thin across the entire pitch.

Now Italy did press high. When they stepped, we literally starting passing backwards immediately - searching for a pass to Barkas! There was no point when Italy was forced to do the same by us.

To play a high line all banks of players have to be compact. Every time Italy had the ball, our CBs were miles too deep (as they always are), there was never any threat of the Italians being caught offside as a high line seeks to do:

[Dean97]

Reaper is right we were very deep for almost the whole game. Our attack was rubbish. Not threatening at all. Played the wrong system in which the players not suited for. Fortounis hardly pressed. Pelkas would have been better as the false 9. The lack of support from our midfielders was pathetic. No one to help, leaving Fortounis to do it himself. Even Ronaldo or Messi would’ve struggled with no support.

We couldn’t hold onto the ball. There was no movement. We looked like amateurs. Samaris and Kourbelis are not skillful enough to hold possession. Siovas tried his best but wasn’t good enough especially playing a role he hasn’t played for like 7 years. He did press and try to give pressure. I’ve been a fan of Stafylidis and I finally see what Reaper was talking about. At times it seemed like he wasn’t there, that’s how easy it was for him to get beaten. It was like he was a ghost. Lykogiannis would’ve been more solid and an interesting fact to note is that we haven’t conceded a goal when he has played. A true solid fullback. I have come to accept that Koutris and Lykogiannis are better than Stafylidis.

Being composed is one thing, but being a good defender is another and every time Italy attacked on the left I got nervous every time. Not a good sign. He would be useful off the bench. We could play him on the wing or CM if we need him to score a screamer which he is capable of.

It’s funny how people now see that Bouchalakis is better than Samaris. I’ve always rated Bouchalakis. He is not a world beater but he is more of a CM than Samaris and would have done better than him in the 4-3-3 false formation Anastasiadis put. But I also believe Androutsos is better than both.

[Don Giovanni]

Guys look right before the first goal. Look at how high Zeca was for a right-back. He made a run to stretch the Italian defense, only for Sokratis' long ball to fall short to an Italian defender. As soon as Greece lose possession, Zeca was chasing down the keeper and then Sirigu slipped up with his pass. Masouras almost carved out a chance for Kolovos to score from inside Italy's area. Then Zeca made a sliding challenge on Veratti and Italy were scrambling just in front of their penalty area before playing the ball out to safety, winning a throw-in a little inside of the Greece half.

When we conceded the first the goal, it was immediately after this play from the throw-in. Italy attacked down our right with Zeca out of position because he was caught out playing way too high and pressing in central areas. Samaris and Siovas didn't protect the defense and we copped a goal.

Anastasiadis kept telling his players to push up. Anytime the camera focused on him, all he did was wave his hand to encourage the players to push higher.

The problem was we had no one in the middle who could play proper passes. We had Siovas and Samaris attempting to play through-balls. We had Stafylidis copping the ball at the hallway line and Greece then scrambling back, which led to us conceding the second goal. Sokratis couldn't make long balls. Beyond Fortounis, no one could play a decent pass.

[Don Giovanni]

Anastasiadis at half-time to his players:

«Τι είναι αυτά που κάνετε; Δεν μαρκάρετε, κάνετε βήματα πίσω, αντί να πάτε πάνω στους παίκτες. Λες και φοβάστε με τους μαρκάρετε. Κάθε πάσα είναι και ένα λάθος. Συνέρθετε. Ξυπνήστε. Διαχειριστείτε το σκορ. Να ανέβουμε πιο ψηλά, μπας και βάλουμε κανένα γκολ. Είναι καλύτεροι από εμάς, αλλά προσπαθήστε. Βγείτε και παίξτε καλύτερα, σκυλιάστε. Ξυπνήστε. Για να μην ξεφτιλιστούμε…».

What are those things you are doing? You're not pressing, you're running back, instead push forward to press against their players. The way you're playing says that you're scared to press them. Each pass we are making is also wrong. Wake up. Get back onto the scoreboard. We should play higher, go up and let's score a goal. They're better than us, but try. Get out and play better, like dogs. Wake up. So that we don't embarrass ourselves.

[Don Giovanni]

I don't understand how we could go into this game against Armenia with our heads down like this. We needed to be better than this and it's unfortunate it took a half-time regroup and pep talk to get the team to wake up after going down once again to a 2-0 scoreline. We were better than Armenia and Fortounis' goal proved it.

Now in comes Dellas because I don't see who else can do the job at this point. Another cycle will need to be completed before a more appropriate manager can helm the team.

[Dean97]

If we go for another Greek coach we might aswell stay with Anastasiadis. We should just hit rock bottom. I don’t know how low we can go after today. Our biggest issue is midfield. Whether we put Samaris, Zeca, Bouchalakis, Kourbelis, Siopis, Tachtsidis and so on it won’t make a difference they are all limited.

For example I will list out the problems for each player:
Samaris: weak minded, no vision, slow, weak tackler, no presence, too defensive
Tachtsidis: Slow, concentration, mobility, error prone, inconsistent
Zeca: poor ball control, no vision, no presence
Siopis: Short, a bit weak, makes errors
Kourbelis: one dimensional, no presence, lack of ball skills, too defensive.
Bouchalakis: Slow, error prone, slow thinker

They all have no attacking instincts. There technique let them down and can not control the game or keep possession well. They lack real vision to put us through on goal. We don’t have quality here. They are all D grade at best. Samaris is worse of the bunch but still plays at Benfica.

Androutsos, Galanopoulos can help us slightly but still won’t be enough. Anyone else we put is either D grade or lower, so there is no point. We would have to change formations play 4-3-3. One true holding mid who cleans up in front and organises. Zeca or Bouchalakis are my pick. Fortounis and Bouzoukis would be ahead of one of them. Bouzoukis has quality and has a killer shot. He has been compared to Modric from Italian sources. Time to blood him in. Galanopoulos should replace Samaris in the call ups.

We we should be more attacking, enough of the doubt. Sokratis, Manolas, Mavropanos, Risvanis, Papadopoulos, Siovas and Retsos are good CBs. Retsos should be the new RB. With Koutris and Lykogiannis fighting for the LB spot. Vlachodimos in goals for the next 10 years...

If want to play wingers the Lamprou, Limnios, Kolovos, Masouras, Chatzigiovannis, Fetfatzidis and Gianniotas should all be in contention. Mitroglou or Donis upfront depending on the opposition. We should play a highline and press. Fortounis will be our go to guy with Bouzoukis as his support and 2nd in command for our attack. Koutris can bomb forward and create some added width.

Will all this happen most likely not but I would do this if we want to change. Kotsiras, Pelkas, Mantalos, Tachtsidis, Kourbelis and Koulouris as back ups. Samaris and Stafylidis out of the team. If Sokratis and Manolas leave then Mavropanos should play along with Siovas or Papadopoulos.

[Dean97]

We can still come 2nd. We have to win the 4/6 matches and at best draw the games against Italy and Bosnia. It’s up to us...

[Don Giovanni]

They're saying Ouzonidis would be the favorite to replace Anastasiadis. He's not a better solution, he's worse. I think AEK's run in the UCL is testament to why he has no business coaching Greece. And Dellas should do himself a favor and avoid coaching Greece, but I hope he has a word with some of the players, Manolas in particular, and gets them to realize they can't have things any easier and must raise the team themselves, like Zidane did with Domenech.

The players need to realize a better coaching isn't coming until they perform like they deserve a coach who will want to work with them. No one will want to work with this sorry group if they continue to think things need to come easy. I'm done seeing Mitroglou too lazy to chase a pass overshot by Samaris because Northern Ireland is winning 3-0 like I saw under Tsanas. Work with what you have and just try. Manolas too has to understand that and do more to help out his teammates who he knows aren't good enough even though the coach plays them. He has to accept that and play at a higher gear. He has to step up, just like Samaris did even though he was running around like a chicken with it's head cut off. Try! Likewise anyone else who doesn't want to put the extra effort in. Just because the Greek version of Harry Redknapp isn't everyone's cup of tea doesn't give them any excuses.