The John van't Schip replacement thread

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  • Originally posted by Brklyngrk View Post
    I think he should be given a shot. We are playing better and with much more urgency. I remember watching previous games and our guys would just walk around. The three games you posted above, I do not believe are a reflection of how the team is doing currently. The Finland/Italy game, it was when he was first named coach. If you compare that game to the game we played them before in the same cycle, you would see a huge improvement. The Austria game is a little misleading as it was a friendly and we were winning the entire game up until the end.
    How about this home game that lasted 96 minutes, just another anomaly like Austria, Italy and Finland etc etc..

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    • Reaper good posts. We can rave all we want about the better possession and shots, but the reality is we’re not hitting the target. That tells me the system is working the players are not. Unfortunately I don’t see an end to bakasetas and friends unless we bring in a coach who can see that. The mighty bakasetas of Alanyaspor with no weak foot and couldn’t cut it for AEK. That’s our captain boys. Remember when we actually had decent coaches? We qualified for almost every tournament with ease

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      • We almost qualified under Skibbe but lost to a team that made the WC finals. Ultimately, we need better strikers. The one thing about the Ethniki from Otto to Santos is that we would get one chance, but bury it. Badlock is supposedly going to be called up to shore up the RB position. At the very least, we need depth there as we have no one to play there outside of Bakakis.

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        • Originally posted by Reaper View Post

          Dunno man.. I think you are overestimating our attacking prowess and I think my statement that we have gone whole games with 1 or 2 shots on target under VS is correct..



          I think vs Italy was another..

          Come on re Reaper, a friendly and our first two games with JVS... my stats are far more relevant, you can’t seriously be looking at his first games. I’m not sure why this is a big basis of your argument anyway, the stats show we have picked up our game intensity since 2014, and you can see it.

          As Brklyngrk points out, we’ve gona years watching this team play at walking pace and your gona tell us now we are not playing better? Come on re file

          We will go around in circles some of us want to to stay and he will while some others don’t want him to stay.

          If he persists with Bakasetas at 10 and only 1 striker he will probably fail his missing for Qatar
          Last edited by Amorgos; 11-24-2020, 06:58 PM.

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          • Originally posted by Brklyngrk View Post
            We almost qualified under Skibbe but lost to a team that made the WC finals. Ultimately, we need better strikers. The one thing about the Ethniki from Otto to Santos is that we would get one chance, but bury it. Badlock is supposedly going to be called up to shore up the RB position. At the very least, we need depth there as we have no one to play there outside of Bakakis.
            Don’t remind me. Stafylidis nightmare at CB, Maniatis at rb with no club football, Zeca on the wing. Bakasetas, Tzavellas, Tziolis had to be in there too. It’s all coming back to me. One of my closest high school friends is Croatian I called him up before hand to tell him it was gonna be 4 or 5 zip right after I saw the lineup. Don’t ever give Skibbe any credit for anything regarding the Greek national team. He contributed to the decline. Some of these coaches have put out unforgivable lineups. I’m 21 years old and could’ve put out better Greece lineups than any coach from the last 6 years. That’s just so unacceptable, so amateur
            Last edited by Ethnikos; 11-24-2020, 07:25 PM.

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            • Originally posted by Ethnikos View Post

              Don’t remind me. Stafylidis nightmare at CB, Maniatis at rb with no club football, Zeca on the wing. Bakasetas, Tzavellas, Tziolis had to be in there too. It’s all coming back to me. One of my closest high school friends is Croatian I called him up before hand to tell him it was gonna be 4 or 5 zip right after I saw the lineup. Don’t ever give Skibbe any credit for anything regarding the Greek national team. He contributed to the decline. Some of these coaches have put out unforgivable lineups. I’m 21 years old and could’ve put out better Greece lineups than any coach from the last 6 years. That’s just so unacceptable, so amateur
              100%. I mean it is laughable. Skibbe set back Greece years. His stupid legacy players - Tzavellas, Kakasetas and friends are still around and his habit of playing players out of position to protect favorites, grudges, vendettas etc is still in use.

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              • I think with the national team we are just going to have to accept what we get. This federation isn’t capable enough to get someone good enough for the team. It’s a real shame really because I agree that we have a better talent pool to choose from these days. We are just going to have to accept JVS as our coach.

                When your midfield is built around Bakasetas and Kourbelis and your defence around Stafylidis and Tzavellas you know you’ve reached your ceiling as a team. If we can’t top a group with the likes of Kosovo, Moldova and Slovenia (who only have 2 world class players) then JVS is doing something wrong. Against teams like Belgium, Spain and Germany, Stafylidis and Tzevallas will get embarrassed and Bakasetas and Kourbelis would hardly touch the ball let alone stuff every attacking opportunity.

                I like the way JVS wants to play (attacking and possession) but he’s doing it with the wrong players in my opinion.

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                • https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcas...=1000500048744

                  Check it out guys, includes a shout out to the forums here

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                  • Heard the show, good job!

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                    • At The end of the day I do NOT agree with some of his selections I'm with you guys on that. I do not want to see Bakasetas playing and i would rather see Manolas on the team as long as his attitude doesn't bring down the team. this is a REBUILD guys there is no band aid solution for this team, you cant keep doing the same thing over and over again and change coach after coach and think the results are going to change it doesn't work like that. Sometimes certain personalities don't gel and you are trying to build a team with chemistry not around one particular player. Do i hope JVS has learned something from this campaign regarding players selections? i hope so we will see in the next campaign. But after 2014 it was evident this team needed an overhaul. Look at any other sport when there is a rebuild and a transition of younger players coming up and playing there are growing pains. I truly think the team is headed in the right direction and with a few changes to our line up as i mentioned above i think we can continue to improve.

                      Are we playing more attractive football under JVS? Yes

                      Does he have the team buying into his systems? Yes

                      Is it fair to fire this coach after such a short sample size when he is now starting to turn the team around for the better? NO

                      Have we always struggled to get shots on target even when we had Mitro, Manolas, Socratis, and compnay? Yes

                      Were we barely squeaking out 1-0 wins against minnows in the past - YES


                      If you change the coach now before the world cup all the good that has happened now would be erased and your back at square one with the coach implementing new changes and anew system again. With EVERY COACH we have all complained over player selections this is NOT the first time. I do get everyone's frustration as I have been gutted with the failure of the team for so many years but i think we are improving.

                      lastly we know the EPOs budget for landing a top quality coach is not there as they are not willing to increase the funds to hire a world class coach.

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                      • Originally posted by Dean97 View Post
                        I think with the national team we are just going to have to accept what we get. This federation isn’t capable enough to get someone good enough for the team. It’s a real shame really because I agree that we have a better talent pool to choose from these days. We are just going to have to accept JVS as our coach.

                        When your midfield is built around Bakasetas and Kourbelis and your defence around Stafylidis and Tzavellas you know you’ve reached your ceiling as a team. If we can’t top a group with the likes of Kosovo, Moldova and Slovenia (who only have 2 world class players) then JVS is doing something wrong. Against teams like Belgium, Spain and Germany, Stafylidis and Tzevallas will get embarrassed and Bakasetas and Kourbelis would hardly touch the ball let alone stuff every attacking opportunity.

                        I like the way JVS wants to play (attacking and possession) but he’s doing it with the wrong players in my opinion.
                        i don't believe stafylidis is in the manager's plans for CB. i can also count up to the number 9 or so, 9 players who were/are worse in the NT 11 than stafylidis. out of position or not. stafylidis has had a boat-load of injuries and his NT prospects are dim. our left side looks to be fairly good in the immediate future - i'd worry about RB.

                        i'm also not sold at all on some type of greece NT renaissance with pace of play/more passes completed/possession. i believe we have a promising side - they did the domination trick over 'c' nation sides. we hit rock bottom, some new talented faces and it's fresh air - for now. that CM is still brutal, depending on group dec.'s draw, i wouldn't rate our chances. if we finish 2nd in a group and make a playoff draw - most victories will be the kolofapdia type - 39% possession/2 shots attempted/1 goal in 1-0 victories. svarnas will need to show immediate improvement in his defensive play the rest of the season to win me over.

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                        • Originally posted by aek66 View Post

                          i don't believe stafylidis is in the manager's plans for CB. i can also count up to the number 9 or so, 9 players who were/are worse in the NT 11 than stafylidis. out of position or not. stafylidis has had a boat-load of injuries and his NT prospects are dim. our left side looks to be fairly good in the immediate future - i'd worry about RB.

                          i'm also not sold at all on some type of greece NT renaissance with pace of play/more passes completed/possession. i believe we have a promising side - they did the domination trick over 'c' nation sides. we hit rock bottom, some new talented faces and it's fresh air - for now. that CM is still brutal, depending on group dec.'s draw, i wouldn't rate our chances. if we finish 2nd in a group and make a playoff draw - most victories will be the kolofapdia type - 39% possession/2 shots attempted/1 goal in 1-0 victories. svarnas will need to show immediate improvement in his defensive play the rest of the season to win me over.
                          It think it’s all about who is better than who. I saw the highlights of OLY vs PAO game and 2 PAO young players stood out. They were Alexandropoulos and Zagaritis. Alexandropoulos looks like he is better than Kourbelis.

                          For the national team and looking at our talent pool, players like Limnios, Galanopoulos, Tsimikas, Giannoulis, Fortounis, Zeca, Hatzidiakos and maybe Mantalos are all good enough to start for the team in my opinion. We don’t really have standout players. The other players I have mentioned haven’t impressed me enough and aren’t really good enough for the team. CM is a real problem as we haven’t got depth there. We can’t be reverting back to Samaris and Tachtsidis again in my opinion. Kourbelis and Bouchalakis aren’t any better so we really do have a problem there.

                          I think having Galanopoulos back in there will be only a slight improvement but nothing more. Untested players like Vasiliadis, Androutsos and Mantalos in that position need to be given a chance. 2 DMs doesn’t work with us. We also can’t be playing 2DMs against weaker opponents.

                          To conclude we need to find the right balance. We need to have Manolas and Siovas back in the team and have Fortounis back in his position. If we get these things done then we might have a chance of qualifying. I don’t see us qualifying with Tzavellas or Stafylidis at CB and with Kourbelis and Bakasetas in our midfield. Our striker situation is what it is. It’s not like we don’t have players scoring for there teams. They are mostly young aswell. We just need the right players around the striker to get the goals in.

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                          • i agree with the balance - too many names thrown around. it's a few names in the CM and settling on the attacking tridente. i don't even consider manolas an issue, get him back in. jvs may have been given the story with plenty of negative sauce about manolas' purposeful yellow against cyprus that kept him out of the first croatia play-off match.

                            all in all, i'd keep jvs for one more qualification round. epo will keep him, he's under contract. point is moot debating whether he'll get the sack.

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                            • At this point I think JVS is wanting for Manolas and Siovas to sort of beg to come back and play for the team. I keep hearing JVS say I want players that want to play and fight for the shirt. I don’t think he’s going to reach out to them. He would’ve done it already. It’s a real shame for Greece because Manolas is a very talented CB. Siovas is good too but he isn’t on the same level.

                              Also Manolas is 29 playing for Napoli while Tzavellas is 33 and playing in Turkey. Where’s the common sense? When we vs stronger opposition our lack of quality is really going to show. That’s why it’s important to have Manolas back in the side. To help the team in defence when we can’t score.

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                              • Personally I don't think JVS is waiting for Manolas or Siovas to beg, i think JVS is stubborn i think with JVS once you get on his radar your cut from him and i don't think he gives 2nd chances, Just look at Fetfa he was late for one meeting and instead of being suspended for the next call up he's been completely cut without given another chance, Maybe this is his way to change the culture of the team but he needs to have an open-mind and realize guys make mistakes. In regards to Manolas i don't think he's personally disrespected the team or has done anything personally to JVS i think JVS is black listing Manolas based on what he's heard from previous coaches. JVS in my opinion owes it to the team to field the best possible line up with out having players that will disrupt the team. I hope he realizes the stiff competition that we will face in the world cup qualifiers and reaches out and has a talk with these guys. In my opinion if he was going to reach out to these players he would have done it by now.
                                Last edited by Jsoul; 12-02-2020, 06:17 PM.

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