Well even beyond the Big 5 stat JVS quoted, in this round 97 of the 132 starting eleven players from all matches where foreigners!!!
The John van't Schip replacement thread
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You can't make a chicken salad out of chicken shit, though I've been to a few restaurants in Kaisairiani that certainly tried. ;)
AEK coming up from the lower divisions had no choice but to opt for cheap domestic players and found a few decent ones along the way--but when you get to the SL all of the sudden the best players in the league are foreigners and as used to be the case, the NT suffers.
I don't think we're cursed; we have five players in the Bundesliga: Retsos, Koutris, Lampropoulos, Stafylidis, and Mavropanos. Diamantakos is playing in Croatia. Tziolis, Tsimikas and Giannoulis are in the EPL. Donis is playing in Ligue 1, sadly. A shitload of players are in the Eredivisie currently. All of this experience has to make some kind of difference but ultimately if we're relying on JVS to make decisions based on who's in form instead of who the EPO tells him to choose, we're fucked.
We're now going on 8 years out of national tournaments and I grew up mostly knowing this to be the reality lol so it doesn't bother me as much as the fact that there's no reason we shouldn't be competing for at least 2nd out of any group based on present players.
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The state of Greek football is at its lowest in my opinion. The league reflects the EPO. The people in charge have to go and the mentality has to change. Especially in regard in the development of the game and how we treat the Greek players. There should be no reason why our teams ignore and discourage our Greek players. You look at players like the keeper Athanasiadis, Kolovos, Giakoumakis, Koutris, Douvikas, Pelkas, Bakasetas, Siopis and Tzavellas doing better abroad than in Greece needs to be taken into consideration. Also other players that I’m forgetting. This is definitely an EPO issue as I think there need to be rules in place for certain amount of foreigners that come into the clubs. This season is worse than last season. Last season we saw players like Alexandropoulos, Tzolis, Pinakas and Zagaritis show there talent. Season before that we had more trust in Greeks aswell. Our players seem to be treated better abroad.
I look at Cyprus and they look more organised and even there stadiums look more modern than ours. Until we see more Greeks in the league and better stadiums, the league will continue to be on the decline as our position in the rankings for both league ranking and international are not great.
Doesn’t help bringing in average to low quality coaches for the national team aswell.
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I don't think anyone is blaming the whole domestic player situation for the state of the national team, and neither do i think was JVS.
Regardless and this is just my opinion beyond the EPO/VS issue, even if the best 11 in "our" eyes was selected yes qualification would become a little easier, but is that really enough? just qualification?are we not beyond that ambition for the national team? (granted picking our best 11 would help obviously)
The biggest problem i see with the lack of support for greek players in the league, is when one of those of players finally manages to squeeze through and actually shine " most recent example Tzolis" they end up seeking/moving overseas to mediocre sides far too early and to teams that will never achieve any european qualification or get any big match experience, which our golden generation had in spades and predominantly through greek teams playing in europe against man utd, real madrid, Barca, Juve etc. The new generation does not know what its like playing big games in bigs tournaments, and sticking to the Tzolis example, playing Liverpool and Chelsea whilst at Norwich is not the same. The pressure to win when noone is expecting you to win is nothing compared to the pressure playing in any of the top Greek sides, where winning every game is demanded by the fans, media and owners. We have completely devalued our league when Norwich, VVVs, Alanyaspors, Sherrif Tiraspols are seen as a step up for the players. Tsimikas earned his transfer to Liverpool representing Olympiakos in the champions league, not playing with Bournemeouth in the EPL.
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I agree with most of your points. But I do think our league has been declining only because other smaller leagues have evolved. Also our teams have declined in Europe as Olympiakos are playing Europa and PAOK are in the lowest European league there is. This is not good at all.
I think the best thing right now is for our players to go abroad and build there confidence in leagues that are growing. Whether that would be Belgium, Denmark or Netherlands. Tzolis made the right choice in my opinion. He’s playing in arguably the best league in the world. This will only get other better teams looking at him like in Italy and Spain and even other teams in England.
Kolovos and Athanasiadis are playing against Real Madrid in the champions league. A Moldovan side Sheriff are in the champions league and Olympiakos isn’t… what does that tell you.Last edited by Dean97; 09-28-2021, 07:51 AM.
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It's just a natural progression that clubs in former communist nations adopt capitalism and slowly compete with and overtake greek teams who never pushed their advantage of creating a proper football infrastructure. However Greece still has some aces. New stadia for paok, pao, aek and aris will left the greek league miles above Azerbaijan and other weird places. Also we have b teams now. And finally the fans.. What holds Greek football back the most is the EPO and poor infrastructure.
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Yeah Donis seems like he would do well with Greece. I still think we can do well even without Sokratis, Manolas and Siovas. But if I was to choose one to come back it would be Manolas because he is the youngest out of the 3 and most talented. It’s just that JVS has made many mistakes with his tactical approach and player selections. I appreciate him bringing the younger talent, something that past coaches didn’t do but I think it’s time to move on as I think we’ve reached our ceiling with JVS as coach.Last edited by Dean97; 10-13-2021, 09:14 PM.
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