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Originally posted by JVC
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What will Israel do....let Turkey take over the gas project, and lose out on billions they have been planning for a decade? -
Lets look at the bigger picture. Israel is leading this project, and has left Turkey on the sidelines. I see bargaining over war on this issue. However its up to Israel to decide.Originally posted by Reaper View PostComment
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I see, the maps are indicating Turkey has expanded its borders on the eastern Mediterranean, covering the Greek islands. .Basically you believe a Turkey invasion is on the horizon? That might be the case....only time will answer the question.Originally posted by Reaper View PostComment
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As they celebrate Ataturk's 100th anniversary of when he first became prime minister. This new provocation isn't some FaceBook post run by a "fan" anymore. This is the foreign ministry proper saying this.
Basically, Turkey is claiming we can't put our military where want inside our own territory, as if to suggest they decide what goes on our own land (as if they get to decide where our military can go). Moreover, they're instructing us not to keep our military in areas highlighted about a year ago in the map pictured below . Look closely and you'll understand the problem soon enough. This is Turkey's real position of how they view their borders to ours:
They are still busy trying to partition and annex parts of Syria and Libya. All of which goes to show their goal is expansionism and rebirth of their empire, despite their denials.Comment
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The way I see it is....I find it a coincidence that all this started when Greece, Cyprus and Israel were working on a deal for a gas line, and has escalated when a deal was signed. I also associate the Turkish involvement in Turkey part of the equation, especially after they agreed on new joint borders expanding into the Mediterranean past Greek waters close to Crete. When I look into this....I see 2 outcomes. 1 involve Turkey on the deal, or Turkey will not allow this project. Basically there's no chance that pipeline gets going between Greece, Cyprus and Israel.Comment
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Greece will not listen....they will do what they want on our land!Originally posted by Don Giovanni View PostAs they celebrate Ataturk's 100th anniversary of when he first became prime minister. This new provocation isn't some FaceBook post run by a "fan" anymore. This is the foreign ministry proper saying this.
Basically, Turkey is claiming we can't put our military where want inside our own territory, as if to suggest they decide what goes on our own land (as if they get to decide where our military can go). Moreover, they're instructing us not to keep our military in areas highlighted about a year ago in the map pictured below . Look closely and you'll understand the problem soon enough. This is Turkey's real position of how they view their borders to ours:
They are still busy trying to partition and annex parts of Syria and Libya. All of which goes to show their goal is expansionism and rebirth of their empire, despite their denials.
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Greek Party Leader: We should have destroyed Turkish jets harassing our Defence Minister
Although the Greek government condemned (
)Turkey’s harassment of a Greek military helicopter transporting the Minister of National Defence Nikos Panagiotopoulos, and the Chief of General Staff Konstantinos Floros, the leader of political party Greek Solution (Ελληνική Λύση) suggested a much more drastic response.
Kyriakos Velopoulos, a Member of Parliament and President of the Greek Solution, demanded the shooting down of Turkish fighter jets, such as those that harassed Panagiotopoulos and Floros on Sunday.
According to Velopoulos, the Turks continue their “stupidity” and, in addition to harassing the helicopter, they once again made overflights over the Eastern Aegean islands of Oinousses and Agathonisi.
In fact, he added that these “idiots” who are harassing Greek jets must be “destroyed.”
Panagiotopoulos spoke about the incident that took place on Sunday, when Turkish fighter jets harassed the helicopter that himself and the Chief of General Staff General Konstantinos Floros were flying in.
Panagiotopoulos condemned the Turkish provocation, as reported by Greek City Times, stating from Farmakonisi: “Shortly before, the helicopter that transported us was harassed by Turkish fighters. I have to admit that we did not feel this harassment. On the contrary, when we looked up at the sky we saw the Greek fighters who had already expelled the Turkish fighters from the area. What I would like to say, however, is that such behaviour on Turkey’s part does not help to ease the tension that both sides () should seek at this time. However, we are not afraid at all (
). I would like to congratulate the members of the Armed Forces who are guarding the borders as vigilant guards along the entire length of the country’s land and sea borders, as they have always done.”
Although Velopoulos’ suggestions would surely lead to war (), endless statements of denouncements also will not stop Turkey’s daily air violations.
Turkey in 2019 violated Greek airspace 4,811 times, and it appears that 2020 will be no different.
So other solutions must be found that can hinder Turkey’s daily aggression without resulting in war, such as sanctions or cut of diplomatic relations. This may upset the NATO alliance, but is necessary to stop Turkish aggression.
The Greek Solution wants friendly relations with China, India and Russia, and takes pro-Russian stances, but Party spokesman Vangelis Fanidis also emphasised in 2019 that “We go with Greece’s interest wherever that lies – Russia, America, China. We go logically towards Christian Russia, but it’s not a sure thing given Russia’s current alliance with Turkey.”
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Turkey is not getting into war with Greece....Turkey will stop all gas and oil projects in the area, especially now that they have Libya. Turkey is the regional power....do you think that they would sit back and allow Greece, Israel and Cyprus to make deals, and not be included? Cyprus over Turkey in oil and gas deals? I have seen documentaries on this from world energy leaders and diplomats....would you like me to send it? All experts on this say....there's no way gas or oil comes out of that region without Turkish inclusion. They're the regional power.Originally posted by Reaper View PostGreek Party Leader: We should have destroyed Turkish jets harassing our Defence Minister
Although the Greek government condemned ()Turkey’s harassment of a Greek military helicopter transporting the Minister of National Defence Nikos Panagiotopoulos, and the Chief of General Staff Konstantinos Floros, the leader of political party Greek Solution (Ελληνική Λύση) suggested a much more drastic response.
Kyriakos Velopoulos, a Member of Parliament and President of the Greek Solution, demanded the shooting down of Turkish fighter jets, such as those that harassed Panagiotopoulos and Floros on Sunday.
According to Velopoulos, the Turks continue their “stupidity” and, in addition to harassing the helicopter, they once again made overflights over the Eastern Aegean islands of Oinousses and Agathonisi.
In fact, he added that these “idiots” who are harassing Greek jets must be “destroyed.”
Panagiotopoulos spoke about the incident that took place on Sunday, when Turkish fighter jets harassed the helicopter that himself and the Chief of General Staff General Konstantinos Floros were flying in.
Panagiotopoulos condemned the Turkish provocation, as reported by Greek City Times, stating from Farmakonisi: “Shortly before, the helicopter that transported us was harassed by Turkish fighters. I have to admit that we did not feel this harassment. On the contrary, when we looked up at the sky we saw the Greek fighters who had already expelled the Turkish fighters from the area. What I would like to say, however, is that such behaviour on Turkey’s part does not help to ease the tension that both sides () should seek at this time. However, we are not afraid at all (). I would like to congratulate the members of the Armed Forces who are guarding the borders as vigilant guards along the entire length of the country’s land and sea borders, as they have always done.”
Although Velopoulos’ suggestions would surely lead to war (), endless statements of denouncements also will not stop Turkey’s daily air violations.
Turkey in 2019 violated Greek airspace 4,811 times, and it appears that 2020 will be no different.
So other solutions must be found that can hinder Turkey’s daily aggression without resulting in war, such as sanctions or cut of diplomatic relations. This may upset the NATO alliance, but is necessary to stop Turkish aggression.
The Greek Solution wants friendly relations with China, India and Russia, and takes pro-Russian stances, but Party spokesman Vangelis Fanidis also emphasised in 2019 that “We go with Greece’s interest wherever that lies – Russia, America, China. We go logically towards Christian Russia, but it’s not a sure thing given Russia’s current alliance with Turkey.”Comment
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This is the exact line Erdogan repeats. Greek sovereignty second to 'Turkish inclusion' and Greece sharing with Turkey..Originally posted by JVC View Post
Turkey moved on Libya to take the southern Cretan sea and claimed it the same week after signing an agreement with the GNA.
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Greece has that claimed....and legally recognized? If I mistaken.Originally posted by Reaper View Post
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Greece's claims are just claims however Greece is too afraid to even claim a 12 mile EEZ anywhere in Greece because of Turkey's causi belli. Turkey has an actual agreement with the UN/EU backed Syrian Government of Sarraj to drill south of Crete.Originally posted by JVC View PostComment
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I understand what you're thinking....however like I said, I have seen documentaries on this from diplomats and energy experts, together with regional experts from oil and gas producing nations. The easiest route for the line is through Cyprus near Turkish borders, and then cutting across Greek waters....so again you need both countries to agree. The second route is going directly to Create and connecting, because of water depth restrictions. In order for Turkey to take another route the depths of the waters reach close to 20 thousand feet....a project like that is almost impossible. So again both countries need each other. There's no way around it.Originally posted by Reaper View Post
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Here's a little history lesson for you JVC:
https://www.economist.com/europe/200...etic-blackmail
Does this form of blackmail sound familiar? Five years later Ukraine is at risk of losing to the whole eastern half of the country to Russia. They already lost Crimea.In May [2009] Russia's prime minister, Vladimir Putin, told the EU that Ukraine must have help paying for gas to fill the Soviet-era storage tanks it uses to meet its domestic needs each winter. If Europe wanted to avoid cut-offs, an emergency loan of some $4.2 billion would be needed, he said. Russian officials and gas bosses added ominously that Ukraine was so cash-strapped it might miss a July 7th deadline for paying its June gas bill.
Turkey can't muscle in our deal. There's no meeting them halfway! End of story. This is about keeping them in check, so they don't get to be in a position where they run the gamut and we're left to their mercy.Comment
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Understood. So does Greece have backing from Russia? EU?Originally posted by Don Giovanni View PostComment
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