Cyprus - Our Brothers

[Dean97]

Greece and Cyprus do not have the IQ to look beyond the failed reporting a bully to teacher strategy. If anything, this strategy has helped create the Aegean Grey Zones. But.. perhaps deep down... subconsciously... many Greeks want Turks back in charge of their lives. It is an unpleasant thing to contemplate but all the pieces fit.. Since the King of Greece was assassinated after the liberation of Salonika - it has been one way traffic both politically and culturally - back to the Ottoman masters. Many Greeks seem lost without them. So what do they do? Play Turkish songs on the radio, have wall to wall Turkish soaps on TV - in Turkish.. We allow them to violate our airspace and we don;t shoot them down. We allow them to sail their frigates in our seas and our ships play with them.. There is no plan, no long term strategy - nothing. Just endless flirting and play-fighting with an older brother.. Just a decline and slow undoing of the Greek revolution.

You must understand that Greece are always on the lookout of Turks. Turkey are always trying to gain control of everything. It’s always been the case since the beginning. I don’t think Greece are lost I think Greece are always stressing out of the possibility that Turkey are going to start a war against them or invade. That’s the government can’t make good decisions or make clear decisions because of Turkey. That’s why Greece is 2nd in the world in purchasing artillery. The government has become corrupt because of this and it is affecting everything such as jobs, sports and so on. We don’t need anyone to take control of Greece. Yes, you can say that the EU are backing Greece but who knows what can happen. Greece are laidback and are continuing to be laidback because of the inflation of tourists. Greece biggest income is from tourism as we all know. Greece have to be laid back so they can bring in more and more people. I believe if Greece didn’t have Turkey on their mind we would see a smoother more stable Greece. Hopefully this happens soon enough as Greece deserves to be free from all the years of countries putting them down and trying to take control of them. Greece will never die file. I’m in Greece at the moment and I’m reflecting on what I’m hearing and seeing.

[Filikieteria1821]

I was in Greece and I think the diaspora is a lot more concerned about Turkey doing anything, than actual Greeks in Greece. I think the constant threat from the turks has almost desensitized Greeks in Greece. After all, this is a reality they deal with on a daily basis.

IMO, we will soon find out what Greece will do in the face of turks because I do believe that the drilling in Cyprus' EEZ is a set up to drill near Kastelorizo. Turkey has always been highly methodical in its approach towards foreign policy. It recognizes that it has 0 right to drill, but does so because it needs to be part of the energy party. Not doing so will lead to lost profit, and also demoralization given their own world view centers around being top dog in the region and in the muslim world.

Greece will obviously need to show up because Kastelorizo links Greece & Cyprus' EEZ. The EU has proven itself to be useless as the "sanctions" put on Turkey were merely for show, with little substance. The US is still more focused on salvaging a relationship with Turkey, even though the Turks foreign policy contradicts US policy.

An anectodal story to shed some light on how some greeks perceive turkey. I was at JFK in NY because I was gearing up to leave for Greece. I was wearing a Hellenic Navy hat getting ready to board and a woman sprung up a conversation with me about how even 30 years ago the turks would constantly threaten to invade, but never did.

It is true that Turkey uses intimidation to constantly pressure Greece, in a multitude of ways, and they have threatened and haven't followed through, but Erdogan's words are not merely words. Even if Turkey does not invade Greece, or Cyprus, the fact that both countries' natural resources are being infringed upon, is enough.

[Dean97]

^ that’s true file, but I’m talking about the people at the top such as the government. The people in Greece seem not to care about it but in reality Turkey are still threatening to do something to Greece. There is a reason why Greece is 2nd in the world behind USA in purchasing artillery. Nearly all the money is going there. I don’t think Greece should be worried but they are. Greece have the EU behind them. There have been talks that Turkey and the USA are In cahoots but what can you believe.

The Greeks are smart trust me it’s just that there is always something in Greece’s rear view mirror that’s always haunting them. You can’t possibly make good decisions when you are continuously full of stress and anxiety. Greece is trying to protect itself. Its just that they are finding it with all these things going on as it dosent want to face another revolution.

In my opinion Greece needs to start taking care of Greece and I believe by buying all these tanks and weapons that’s what they are doing. But they also need leave all the bullshit the Turks are saying and start focusing on making Greece great again especially economically. The Turks are barbarians and have made countries like Albania, Egypt and others into Muslim countries in past history. Not Greece though, as they are still the first and most active and practicing Christian orthodox religion today. Let them threaten that’s all there good at. How about executing first and then seeing what happens. Turkey desperately want to have so much power and as the saying goes give them an inch and they’ll take a mile. They also do desperately want to be part of the EU but Greece isn’t allowing it and rightfully so. They don’t realise what is waiting for them once they make that first move. A whole lifetime Greece have always been cornered and have come through as winners and I don’t expect anything different now. That’s if something does happen which it won’t.

Anyway looking forward to seeing Olympiakos take down Erdegons Batshithere.

[Filikieteria1821]

Greece has been in a state of malaise since 1974. The failure to save Cyprus from the Turks was a turning point in the power struggle in the region. Follow up with crisis in the aegean in the 80's and 90's and we have now essentially accepted a state of grey zones. Greece may be armed to the teeth, but the crisis has made Greece fall behind in terms of military mite. Turkey has used its huge population and economic boom to advance its weapons industry to a degree where they are clearly in the lead. Greece can get back on level playing field, but military strength isn't the only thing in this equation. Greece needs a mental makeover. They operate with not enough heat, they're far too level headed and although diplomatically it comes off great, it gives off a huge stench of weakness.

I miss the Greece that wasn't scared of flexing it's military mite. The albanians are slowly but surely getting rid of the Greekness in ximara, the fakedonians have taken our history, and the turks not only took our homelands, but threaten to take even more.

Greece needs to start thinking about what kind of image its portraying, and needs to recognize that although diplomacy and being level headed is nice, the only way to fight in it's region is to be tough, tougher than Turkey. These people don't understand words, they understand military power.

[Dean97]

Greece are being the bigger and better person in my opinion. Their diplomacy and laidback mentality is what’s bringing in the money. Ofcourse the Skops are wanting our history they are even dressing up like old Cretan/Thessalonian dancers. Their flag is not even their own. Their flag is Greek. Let alone all the traditional and historical aspects they’ve stolen from Greece.

I think with the name, Greece must’ve worked out a deal where they would let the Skops use the name in exchange for cash. Who knows exactly what deal was negotiated, but all I know is that they shouldn’t have the name Macedonia and all the history that belongs with it.

The EU in my opinion are not doing a great job assisting Greece. Why do Greece have to buy all these artilleries? The EU are supposed to support and somewhat supply these weapons. It’s like Greece is by themselves in all this. You have the Albanians causing trouble, the Skops stealing history and names and you’ve got the Turks always circling trying to figure out ways to get in the country again. Greece is always combating everyone.

Let’s not forget Greece are the gateway to Europe. Also the first European country to exist on this earth. Even the Romans/Italians have always envied us and have copied us in terms of Ancient architecture and so on. There is a lot of jealousy going around in the world regarding Greece.

Greece still have their Aircrafts circling the Aegean just in case if there are any invasions. Times have changed Greece have become conservative because of the economy. They seem to be trying their best to build good relationships with everyone including Turkey and so on. They are looking out for the best of the country and not cause any trouble.

As far as Cyprus goes since it’s in the title of the topic they can distance themselves all they like from Greece and blame Greece for what has happened. If they want to be different and on their own then they should fight their own battles. Greece and Cyprus do indeed have a good relationship I guess but over in other countries like people in Australia and possibly America there is this unsettling issue about why they are distancing themselves from Greece and why they should be part of Greece.

[Filikieteria1821]

Some of Cyprus will denounce that they are Greek, and they are their own individual country. But they speak Greek, they are Greek Orthodox Christians, and their history is largely linked to Greece. Ignoring these simple truths is just an effort to create a false identity that doesn't really have any basis in reality.

Greece is trying to get good at real politik by trying to build relationships with its neighbors, but realpolitik also includes showing a nasty streak too. Greece doesn't use its military like it should, and not to derail the topic, but Greece should, for example, arm the Libyan government, versus the jihadist insurgents who are being backed by Turkey.

Turkey is backing these jihadis because its goal is to reach an agreement with Libya regarding EEZ that would squeeze Greece. To me, Greece is too timid. Nothing wrong with being a country that tries diplomacy over war, as war is never good, but Greece acts as if it's a country that doesn't have the weapons is has.

[Filikieteria1821]

http://www.ekathimerini.com/245153/a...outhern-cyprus

Turkey is sending an oil and gas drilling ship to waters off southern Cyprus where Greek Cypriot authorities have already awarded exploration rights to Italian and French companies, according to Turkish statements on Thursday.

The move marks the first time Turkey and Cyprus, which have competing claims in the eastern Mediterranean, will be looking for hydrocarbons in the same exploration block.

The drilling ship Yavuz is on its way to a new well called Guzelyurt-1, Turkish Energy Minister Fatih Donmez tweeted.

Donmez did not disclose the location of the well, but in a separate shipping advisory Turkey released the coordinates within which the drilling ship will be operating.

The coordinates, about 90 km (56 miles) southwest of the port of Limassol, fall within an oil and gas exploration block which Cyprus has awarded to Eni and Total.

The advisory says drilling operations will take place between Oct. 19 and Jan. 20th.

Refinitiv ship tracking data showed the Yavuz heading south around the western side of the island on Thursday.

Asked about the movements of the vessel, which Nicosia says is within its exclusive economic zone, Cypriot President Nicos Anastasiades said: “We are aware of this and are taking all indicative measures based on international law.”

Turkey has already drilled two wells in waters to the east and west of the island, triggering strong protests from Nicosia and the European Union.

Turkey says some of the areas where Cyprus is exploring are either on its own continental shelf, or in zones where Turkish Cypriots have equal rights over any finds with Greek Cypriots.

Nicosia rejects the claim, saying that assertion is not only inconsistent with international law, but that Turkey would not accept any international dispute settlement mechanism where its claims could be put to the test. [Reuters]

This is what happens when you fail to match or exceed your adversaries rhetoric or actions. Special shout out to the EU who's sanctions are laughable at best, and the US, where Trump refuses to implement CAATSA sanctions on Turkey, because Erdogan perhaps is his pal.

Cyprus has used the excuse "we're too small" and has never truly invested in it's military the way they should have, while Greece has allowed Turkey to surpass it in military prowess, with a booming domestic arms industry.

I am sick and tired of Greek government peoples saying the economic issues led to Greece ignoring its armed forces. Under no circumstances should it have been allowed to degrade as it has. We are in need of huge naval upgrades, and while the f16 viper addition is nice, it's a ways away. We need quick solutions to the pressing needs of the Greek armed forces.

Even if we sign an agreement for French Belh@ara frigates, we wouldn't get a ship for at least another 3-4 years.

All in all, this is a very bad scenario because Turkey can and would attack Cyprus if it meant Erdogan gets to score a political/domestic victory and also have a say in the energy game.

Greece & Cyprus have upped their attempts at forming strong relationships with eastern Mediterranean powers (Egypt & Israel) but we all know neither would get involved in a war if it came down to it.

Again Greece and Cyprus have failed to recognize that Turkey does not care about making friends. It has and will continue to operate the same way it has for its entire existence.

[Reaper]

Cyprus needs to publicly send its president to Trump begging for help stating the EU wont help.

Anything else will make Turkey stronger.

[Filikieteria1821]

And yet I have a hard time believing trump will offer any help to Greece or Cyprus.

I have been very turned off by Trumps foreign policy, especially as it relates to Greece & Cyprus. Pair that with the reports that he apparently likes Erdogan, and it's a big no no in my book. Granted, Trump isn't the first, nor will he be the last American president to view Turkey as some sort of untouchable "ally".

I will never understand the thought process American foreign policy makers have, but Greece and Cyprus have to militarily strengthen in a hurry. As of right now, Greece's armed forces are for defensive measures, not offensive. That needs to change fast

[Reaper]

And yet I have a hard time believing trump will offer any help to Greece or Cyprus.

I have been very turned off by Trumps foreign policy, especially as it relates to Greece & Cyprus. Pair that with the reports that he apparently likes Erdogan, and it's a big no no in my book. Granted, Trump isn't the first, nor will he be the last American president to view Turkey as some sort of untouchable "ally".

I will never understand the thought process American foreign policy makers have, but Greece and Cyprus have to militarily strengthen in a hurry. As of right now, Greece's armed forces are for defensive measures, not offensive. That needs to change fast

It is not about Trump's help or not. The action is to highlight the EU's pro Turkish policy.

This week VW announced it will build its new billion euro factory in Turkey.
Also this week Albania was formerly invited to join the EU by EU president / bigwigs.

Cyprus needs to highlight this direction of travel anyway they can.

[Don Giovanni]

A geological survey suggests the eastern Mediterranean holds 350 trillion cubic feet of natural gas and 3.5 billion barrels of oil. There's enough oil and gas between Cyprus, Israel and Egypt to power the EU for 20 years!

Cyprus offered to put 30% of the proceeds into a bank account for the Turks of the island, but Turkey is unhappy that the Greek side is acting unilaterally (which obviously the legitimate half of Cyprus has every right to do). They're only unhappy the Greek Cypriots have found a source to further their independence and wealth, while they don't.

The US doesn't have to offer help. It's up to the EU. And if the EU has no interest in finding a new source of oil and natural gas, especially now that the US continues to do Israel's and Saudi Arabia's bidding vis-a-vis the Iranians, then the EU seeks to fail. I'm more inclined to think we can find better partners in the shape of the UK once they're out of the clutches of the EU's death spiral. The UK once had designs on Cyprus and I'm certain those designs will be revisited again once they leave the EU.

[Reaper]

Russia could be about to recognise Northern Cyprus.

This could just a bullshit rumour, but it could be true also.

Sadly, seeing as Tsipras purposely destroyed relations with Putin and Mitsotakis has done nothing to repair relations - it could happen.

[Soprano76]

I one day hope for a peaceful referendum that allows the whole of Cyprus to unite with the Hellenic motherland.

[Filikieteria1821]

I hate to say it but unless Greece becomes a super power, or we get a Greek nationalist to be the president of the United States, Cyprus will remain divided, with little to no chance of reunification, or flat out be taken by Turkey.

Russia has been back stabbing Greece for over a century, so if they did recognize the "TRNC" it would just further cement that the "xantho genos" isn't going to save Greeks or orthodox christianity.

On another note, the republic of cyprus, and the southern part as it is right now, should be holding a referendum as to whether they want to be part of Greece. If you want to throw a major wrench in the process and watch the Turks clamor as to why this is unfair, that would be the way to go.

But it won't happen because Turkey would use that as a means to invade the rest of the island saying it's a "security concern for turkish cypriots"

[Don Giovanni]

Russia might given their own illegal territorial claim over Crimea.

The other problem with the referendum is we might lose the northern third of the island for good. The Turkish occupation of the island is illegal, and a referendum would change that.