Corona Virus

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  • #46
    It looks like you were right Reaper . There has been a lot of under reporting:

    https://greece.greekreporter.com/202...rom-italy-now/

    Italy actually has an older population than South Korea, but does not have an older population than Germany. Age cannot, therefore, fully explain the dramatic differences in coronavirus death rates.

    The answer can be found, perhaps, if one looks at the age distribution of coronavirus cases in each country, where there are striking differences. While 59.7 percent of cases of coronavirus fatalities in Italy were over 60 years of age (the majority), only 21 percent of cases in South Korea and 15.5 percent of cases in Germany were from the same age group.
    Italy’s policy was selective in examining suspected cases of coronavirus, unlike Germany and South Korea, where there were mass collections of samples and mass analyses were conducted.
    According to official data published on March 15, about 14,800 of the total 24,747 confirmed cases in Italy were in people over the age of 60. This figure actually represents 15-20 percent of all cases, compared to other countries, not the 59.70 percent as Italy officially states.
    Italy is probably approaching or exceeding 100,000 real cases, most of which have not been diagnosed. And seeing the increase in the rate of cases, the difference between actual and confirmed cases is probably increasing daily.
    In short, Dr. Farsalinos believes that the deficient testing for COVID-19 in Italy was the reason much of the younger population has not been diagnosed, and it is certain that a large number of younger Itaiians are infected but are unaware that they carry the virus.
    People are carrying it and don't even know it. Stay home or get tested.

    Most likely, some have had a mild form of the illness, which either did not affect their activities at all or they fell ill for a couple of days and then returned to their daily routine. These were the so-called “moving bombs” (also called super spreaders) who were for the most part responsible for transmitting the coronavirus to the community.
    So what does all this mean for Greece? Greece is currently conducting extremely selective testing for coronavirus, perhaps even more selective than Italy had performed. This means that today we must have a large number of cases that have not been identified and are circulating among us.
    Without the diagnosis and detection of cases, you cannot isolate coronavirus victims from healthy people. Geographical isolation and lockdown are not enough to tackle the problem — they will actually only prolong it.

    A change of attitude is needed now, according to this veteran researcher. Requisition of labs and equipment is needed, and labs need to be properly staffed 24 hours a day. Community intervention is needed to find and control cases, to prepare screening centers for coordinated turnover and sample collection.

    All cases must be found and diagnosed at all costs. And all this has to be done immediately.
    Italy is very close to a herd immunity scenario, that is to say, a much larger part of the population is affected. This is also England’s conscious decision and strategy, based on its Prime Minister’s recent announcements.

    Some have described his decision as “paranoid crazy,” expressing fears that England “is heading towards the macabre primacy of the highest number of deaths in Europe, perhaps in the world, by the coronavirus.”

    Dr. Farsalinos says that Greece does not seem to be consciously employing this strategy, but we must immediately realize that we are still heading for a herd immunity scenario regardless. We need to change tactics now. Otherwise, let’s make a decision and let the government officially inform us that we are implementing such a strategy.

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    • #47
      It looks like Greece will be under total lockdown starting from today (Wednesday). The problem in Greece isn`t as bad as Italy (we only have 5 confirmed dead of the virus), but things could prove too great a challenge for Greece should it get to be that bad, and it may be we are just lagging behind a week or so.

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      • #48
        https://www.jpost.com/Breaking-News/...atients-621258

        More insanity out of Israel:

        The government rolled out a new set of restrictions on the Israeli population Tuesday as the number of coronavirus patients increased to 337 at press time and Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu promised there would be a dramatic increase in the number of sick people detected, tests taken and hospital equipment available to serve the infected.
        “We started today using the digital technology that detects those who come in contact with coronavirus patients,” Netanyahu said in a press briefing. “We will send these people into isolation. These will be large numbers. Isolation is not a recommendation - it is mandatory, and we will enforce it without compromise."

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        • #49
          This could push Italy into a severe recession.

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          • #50
            Cases continue to climb in the USA. Anecdotal stories from physicians and other healthcare workers that I've been reading on the internet show that many hospitals already being overwhelmed with patient loads and lack of equipment.

            I would also caution everyone when reading things about blood type or the association between NSAIDs (ibuprofen) and the severity of COVID-19. Misinformation can be spread quite easily and I would wait until more data is available for these claims.

            A vaccine is absolutely necessary but is likely another year or so away. Mandatory vaccination (with few exceptions) should be implemented, as with any other vaccination.

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            • #51
              China's top coronavirus expert says 'herd immunity' WILL NOT curb the pandemic because the disease is highly infectious and lethal

              'We don't yet have the evidence to prove that if you are infected once, you would be immune for life.'

              https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-pandemic.html

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              • Don Giovanni
                Don Giovanni commented
                Editing a comment
                We're going to have to live with the disease no matter what and some level of tolerance will be built over time. The only problem is how quickly it will spread and whether that prevents people from getting proper care. Johnson should be shutting down schools and doing more to discourage public gatherings.

                The spokeswoman for WHO said something very telling, that they didn't really know enough about the virus and we just need take action because, in other words, its better to be safe than sorry.

            • #52
              Originally posted by Soprano76 View Post
              Cases continue to climb in the USA. Anecdotal stories from physicians and other healthcare workers that I've been reading on the internet show that many hospitals already being overwhelmed with patient loads and lack of equipment.

              I would also caution everyone when reading things about blood type or the association between NSAIDs (ibuprofen) and the severity of COVID-19. Misinformation can be spread quite easily and I would wait until more data is available for these claims.

              A vaccine is absolutely necessary but is likely another year or so away. Mandatory vaccination (with few exceptions) should be implemented, as with any other vaccination.
              You cite anectodal stories from doctors on the internet about how hospitals are already overwhelmed and then caution us that misinformation can be spread quickly?!

              They don't mandate vaccines for the seasonal flu which kills hundreds of thousand every year. And how do you mandate vaccines? Do you jail people? Do you tie them down and then forcibly vaccinate them against their will?

              Let's be clear, the danger of this virus isn't that it's more dangerous than the regular flu. The danger is our hospitals will have too many patients all at once and be unable to care for everyone, which could result in more deaths. That's the challenge and we just need to need take steps to prevent the virus from spreading so quickly so as to prevent people from getting the care they need. The great majority of us probably won't even need any medical attention even if we do catch it (it will basically feel like a regular cold) and really we should all take steps to isolate or distance ourselves more and keep good hygiene--these are basic things that don't require government mandates and shutdowns.

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              • #53
                as mentioned, a potential vaccine is months and months away.

                the key to eliminating panic and fear, along with saving the lives of those most vulnerable, is an anti-viral. a treatment, a therapeutic. from what i understand, this is right around the corner, weeks away.

                the chinese were flying blind and used a hodge-podge of drugs to treat many of the worst..with fatality rates lower than sars of 2002-2003. hopefully, the drug(s) that emerge to treat this virus will be plentiful and accessible. i'd think that the fda in the usa will fast-track the most promising.

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                • #54
                  They're saying don't take advil (ibuprofen). Apparently if you have coronavirus and take advil, it will lead to pneumonia. The WHO only started making this recommendation today. But maybe we should wait until more data is available, we don't want to spread misinformation.

                  It looks like the UK is taking stronger action. They waited too long to shut down the schools; however, and I agree with this, they haven't shut down London. In Italy, the lock down is understandable, but elsewhere I think that would be too extreme. Forcing people into their homes isn't a great solution and it won't cause the virus to disappear. People need to follow advice and be encouraged to stay home and not travel. So long as we halt a rapid spread, that's all that matters.

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                  • #55
                    China could have done a much better job of containing the virus if they had been honest from the get-go.

                    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/c...mber-rz055qjnj

                    Chinese laboratories identified a mystery virus as a highly infectious new pathogen by late December last year, but they were ordered to stop tests, destroy samples and suppress the news, a Chinese media outlet has revealed.

                    A regional health official in Wuhan, centre of the outbreak, demanded the destruction of the lab samples that established the cause of unexplained viral pneumonia on January 1. China did not acknowledge there was human-to-human transmission until more than three weeks later.
                    They should have been more forthcoming and honest from the start. If that had happened, more could have been done to contain the virus. They lied for weeks as the virus incubated and spread.

                    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...st-authorities

                    A doctor in Wuhan has spoken out after seeing several of her colleagues die from the coronavirus, criticising hospital authorities for suppressing early warnings of the outbreak in an interview censors have been trying to erase from the internet.

                    In an interview with the Chinese magazine, Renwu, or People, Ai Fen, director of the emergency at Wuhan Central hospital, said she was reprimanded after alerting her superiors and colleagues of a Sars-like virus seen in patients in December.
                    China blames the virus on a US soldier and the US. Trump says he responded to those claims by calling it a Chinese virus. Now the media and Hillary Clinton are going into overdrive to paint him as a racist. When it comes to China, the rest of the Democratic needs to learn from Biden. He has to stay tough on China and bring this point up when discussing the coronavirus, otherwise Trump will outflank him. Making the coronavirus about Trump's failures will backfire because we won't have millions dead after this: he numbers will resemble seasonal flu numbers.

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                    • #56
                      China has and will be the main enemy of the US going forward. Members of the media are yelling at Trump because he calls it the China virus, while at its inception its been known as the Wuhan virus. It originated there and it spread under the misguided Chinese communist government that seemed intent on keeping it hush hush until it couldn't control what was going on.

                      This virus will have to show the world that globalization is a very serious problem, and the profits of huge corporations that rely on cheap labor in foreign countries, is directly connected to some of the problems we're facing.

                      The majority of US pharmaceuticals are produced in China, and at this point it seems like China has us by the balls. That is not a good feeling as an American.

                      I was watching a short clip from Marco Rubio the other day and it is spot on as it relates to the present issue, especially as it relates to China and their control over the global supply chain

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                      • #57
                        Some points.

                        1/ China - through its communist state apparatus is blaming the US for the outbreak!

                        https://nypost.com/2020/03/17/chinas...laming-the-us/

                        2/ Russia is stupidly blaming Corona Virus on the UK to help out China..

                        https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/111907...ipal-novichok/

                        3/ Western left wing media is concentrating on calling Trump a racist for calling the virus a 'Chinese virus.' This is helping China.

                        https://www.businessinsider.com/trum...20-3?r=US&IR=T

                        https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/18/u...ina-virus.html

                        https://edition.cnn.com/world/live-n...a6443c13a4616a

                        3/ Trump gave one of his best performances today - destroyed the left wing media - stated clearly they called him racist when he closed the border to the Chinese and that that action saved lives (begins on 1hour/19mins):



                        4/ Vox - the left wing media outlet now calling trump a racist every second by accident made a super video explaining how the communist Government is directly responsible for Corona/Sars/H7N9 etc - must watch video and also share with friends if you can:



                        5/ Chinese communist government's attempted cover up when they knew the disease was emerging:






                        So to sum up - left wing media and Russia helping China not take the blame for something they are clearly responsible for.
                        Trump wrecking the left wing media this week. Sadly - this thing still has legs. Chinese Government in full propaganda mode - apparently no one contracted Corona in China today! Trump at the end of the first video hints there will be repercussions for China. They must pay.

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                        • #58
                          I can understand if the Chinese Communists didn't want to cause panic and alarm, but the way it's done via censorship is unacceptable. And they were wrong to deny this virus was contagious and could be transmitted human-to-human. They made a lot of mistakes and need to be a lot more transparent about these things in the future.

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                          • #59
                            More examples of China suppressing the truth about coronavirus:

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                            • #60
                              Originally posted by Don Giovanni View Post
                              I can understand if the Chinese Communists didn't want to cause panic and alarm, but the way it's done via censorship is unacceptable. And they were wrong to deny this virus was contagious and could be transmitted human-to-human. They made a lot of mistakes and need to be a lot more transparent about these things in the future.
                              Like Turkey, they will only respond to strong actions. Words alone will be diluted down to nothing - especially as the Western Left is already batting for them.

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